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RE: CCIE, is it difficult? is it valuable? posted 01/19/2001
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Agree. It took me 22 days to pass 6 MCSE Exams without working experience
two years ago. Now I haven't got my CCIE after 6 months preparing plus work
experience.

-----Original Message-----
From: nobody@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:nobody@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx]On Behalf Of
Shaun Nicholson
Sent: Friday, January 19, 2001 9:50 AM
To: austin.alao
Cc: andrew.2.shore; bhescock; dcai; johcamer; ccielab
Subject: RE: CCIE, is it difficult? is it valuable?


How dare you compare the MCSE to the CCIE they are no way similar, I haved
worked with MCSE's who could not wipe there own arse's with there paper
cetificates I myself started on the MCSE and stoped after 3 exams as I
realized how worthless it was plus I moved to the USA where I concentrated
on working on Cisco equipment more, so that became my chosen path. But still
come on the MSCE is now a big joke throughout the industry you should start
to listen to your peers man. Microsoft did what they always do they cashed
in and turned out armys of Microsoft solders to help sell there products and
it worked. Hell Cisco are doing a similar thing with the CCDA,CCDP, CCNA and
CCNP tracks. I know I've done them too.

I know not all MCSE or any other certs for that matter are paper and I'm not
implying you are, how could I I dont even know you. But I can only speak
from experiances and there are more paper MCSE who do not know what they are
doing out there because they did bootcamps or what ever to get there screen
based non handson certificates. You have to agree with that surerly the rest
of the industry does.

The MCSE is a basic do 6 exams on a computer screen and if you do the
adaptive exams it can take you less than 20 minutes an exam I know I speak
from experiance. I dont even use the letters I was asigned from Microsoft
(MCP) anymore it took me 20 minutes to get a 55% pass. It has taken me 9
months of 40 hours a week in the lab and 3 goes to get my lab ok so the
written is not that hard but the lab is.

So please dont try to bring the CCIE down to the cash sucking level that
Microsoft have with there certification track.

I dont quite understand the plus CCIE-awaiting number comment does that mean
you have not passed the lab yet but have passed the written? have you even
tried the lab yet?

I wish you luck in your persuit of a real handson industry certification.

Thanks
Shaun Nicholson CCIE 6705
Lead Network Engineer
Kaiser Permanente
Silver Spring Data Center
301 680 1462




austin.alao@xxxxxx on 01/19/2001 06:59:00 AM
To:	andrew.2.shore@xxxxxx@Internet, bhescock@xxxxxxxxx@Internet,
dcai@xxxxxxxxx@Internet
cc:	johcamer@xxxxxxxxx@Internet, ccielab@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx@Internet (bcc: Shaun
Nicholson/MD/KAIPERM)
Subject:	RE: CCIE, is it difficult? is it valuable?

Hey Andrew,

I thought from the start of your email that you were actually going to make
a good case for criticising MR Dhezong. You actually ended up doing worse in
my book by trying to ridicule Msoft and us, their engineers.
I am in the UK too, am MCSE+I and proudly so.
Let me also say that I am also CCNP and CCDP, plus CCIE-awaiting number.
While you are Msoft bashing, remember that if you introduced a routine "lab"
to MCSE where you configured Compaq servers, installed software, and
attempted everything on TechNet CD, you would also have a certification
exactly like the hallowed and over-hyped CCIE.
Take pride in your endeavours and don't slag off those of us who think that
Msoft is the most intelligently managed Corporation out there, and owe our
daily-bread to their success.

Lets show respect for fellow professionals and let the matter rest.

Nuff said,

Austin Alao,
01442 431 247 / 07740 148 175
"He Who Brings Sunshine to the Life of Others, Cannot Himself Live in
Darkness"

-----Original Message-----
From: Shore,A,Andrew,YEF36 SHOREA2 C
Sent: 19 January 2001 03:30
To: bhescock@xxxxxxxxx; dcai@xxxxxxxxx
Cc: johcamer@xxxxxxxxx; ccielab@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: RE: CCIE, is it difficult? is it valuable?

Perhaps if you worked in the real world you may find out how EASY Cisco is,
and if you're as good as you think you are, you may even earn some real
money

I work in the UK and currently make over 100k and that's UK pounds not
dollars and I haven't even sat the lab yet. The CCIE is a benchmark used by
companies to rate employees ability, some companies (the one in Redmond)
make their products attractive by giving away certification rendering them a
waste of paper, at least Cisco make people sweat for their accreditation.

A CCIE is nothing with out the real world experience to carry you through
projects, treating CCIE as an academic exercise probably is easy but it
doesn't mean you can do the job.

Just as a matter of interest you neglected to say how many attempts it took.


Andrew Shore
BTcd
Information Systems Engineering
Internet & Multimedia


-----Original Message-----
From: Brian Hescock [mailto:bhescock@xxxxxxxxx]
Sent: 18 January 2001 21:58
To: dezhong
Cc: Cameron, John; ccielab@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: CCIE, is it difficult? is it valuable?


Dezhong,
     You might want to unsubscribe from this list if you think the CCIE is
so
easy and has no real value.  All you're going to do is piss people off by
making comments like that.

Brian

dezhong wrote:

> Hi, John,
>
> You misunderstand me. I like cisco and still work hard for my group as
> before.
> I only want to say here is:  CCIE, just another IT certification. We don't
> need to pay so much attention on it.
> I don't know why so many people think it is so difficult and so valuable?
>
> Dezhong Cai
> Cisco Systems,  CCIE # 6621
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Cameron, John" <johcamer@xxxxxxxxx>
> To: "Cai, Dezhong" <dcai@xxxxxxxxx>
> Sent: Thursday, January 18, 2001 1:34 PM
> Subject: RE: CCIE, is it difficult? is it valuable?
>
> > I wonder why your working at cisco with this kind of attitude.
> >
> > This isn't going to do the company any good when you broadcast
> > e-mails out too a public mail alias.  What are you tring to
> > state here?
> >
> > JC
> >
> > C i s c o  S y s t e m s           John Cameron
> >                                    Network Engineer
> >                                    Research Triangle Park
> >      ||        ||                  Cisco Systems, Inc.
> >      ||        ||
> >     ||||      ||||
> > ..:||||||:..:||||||:..
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: dezhong [mailto:dcai@xxxxxxxxx]
> > Sent: Thursday, January 18, 2001 3:59 PM
> > To: ccielab@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > Subject: CCIE, is it difficult? is it valuable?
> >
> >
> > Hi, all,
> >
> > I heard many stories about how difficult to get the CCIE and how
> > valuable it
> > is.  So now I'm.
> >
> > I joined Cisco last June as a new graduate student without any cisco
> > background.
> > I passed the CCIE in last Dec.  My salary is still as low as 68,000. My
> > grade is still as low as 6. And it seem there is no big promotion in the
> > near future. No promotion to grade 8.
> >
> > I don't feel it is difficult to pass the CCIE. I also doubt the value of
> > the
> > CCIE. In my opinion, even you have CCIE, it still depend on whether you
> > have
> > good experience. Like me, without any work experience except in cisco
> > for
> > several months. Can you see I'm a valuable CCIE?
> >
> >
> > Dezhong Cai
> > Cisco Systems,  CCIE # 6621
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________________
> > To unsubscribe from the CCIELAB list, send a message to
> > majordomo@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx with the body containing:
> > unsubscribe ccielab
>
> _______________________________________________________
> To unsubscribe from the CCIELAB list, send a message to
> majordomo@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx with the body containing:
> unsubscribe ccielab

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